Okay, this is take number 14
Tenuation of section 23.0 with Jack Schmidt
Okay flight data file CSM
Generally, I have nothing but praise for the flight data file both vehicles
There was very very few things that one could have asked for to improve that data file for the four-poly 17 at any rate
One comment on the flight plan supplement
We had split pages for
Number of the logging
Medical and food logging and that probably was a mistake
I think the idea was fairly good initially, but the pages we tended to only use that in the book as a whole and it was a good place to keep them
And also the pages if you had wanted them split were too thin to maintain the split and they tended to fall out of the book
I would recommend either not splitting or having heavier paper if if you want them split
We had I had an extra cue card built for panel 229
I think it was an excellent card that summarized the
Circuit breaker functions both on 229 and on panel 8
Because we had no
Systems and anomalies of any significance that would relate to that card. It was not used
But I would strongly recommend it's availability if only for training
During the end during Sims. It's a good quick review of what you lose or
Retain for those two panels in the flight plan I
Added some penny cues
Along the margins for certain observational
targets that
I particularly wanted to look at
these were independent of any
experiment
designated experiment and
Entered them as a I entered them as a function of a of time and
That that seemed to work very well for me
I think it had that kind of thing as an individual preference item and
If you have experimented ought to be flight planed if you're just planning to use your spare time for
specific observational targets or types of observations
Then I think the pen and ink is maybe the easiest way to go
Since it shouldn't concern any large number of people
Gordy Fullerton
Fixed up the circular
Orbital cue card
For me with a similar designation of
craters as a function of time. I did not use that
Not because it wasn't a good idea, but because
Affirmary already with the moon which came very quickly after a couple orbits and you just you could recognize your position
On the moon fairly easily
As a function of each rev either the time in the rev
Proximum time since sunset
Or just because you could look out the window and tell where you were in the limb
We
The same comments apply I think all the slight data file items were excellent
I did not use the data card book to the extent that I know it was used on 15 and maybe on 16
We logged most of our
specific
Items such as alignment data and
Coppable
Kind of things in the checklist at the point where they were collected rather than in the data book and had no
This did not seem to raise any difficulty at any time the cuff checklist
We've talked about I think in the surface items
I thought the cuff checklist was excellent. I think we did the things we had the right kind of photo maps in there
that
were useful for reference
Where we were
Around a given station. I don't think we used them as much as I had anticipated using them
Mainly because navigation was no problem and the
Appoints that we had selected pre-flight were excellent points for investigation and there was no need to try to
To decide on an alternative points to
to try to
study
in the vicinity of a given station
list of
Items to be accomplished at each station or to
Really they were mind joggers to read at each station
We're not again not as used as much as I thought they would be initially
But I think that was mainly because we both at least I had become so familiar with the items that
Each station was in itself easy to recall
As a result of having created the checklist so
Checklists was turned out to be more of a learning item
Rather than a reference item for use on the surface. I wouldn't have done it any differently. I particularly
want to
Compliment the Chuck Lewis on the timeline book that
I really can't sing I mean but the timeline book was was very very well done and very
Had no problems at the timeline book at all, but that of course applies to the
to
Every every checklist that we had
There were just no procedural errors that I could that I recall and any of the books that we used
Fortunately, we didn't have to use a malfunction
Book are the only once did I pull out the system's data book to check
To check on a systems problem and I
Right now can't remember what that was where it was or did use it once
charts and maps
I thought in the CSM that I would use the order
Orbit what do they see orbit monitor charts? I guess that's what they're called and I had an extra one put on so wouldn't interfere with the planned activities of
Of the CMP. I did not use that
very much
I eventually did some sketching on it post to E.I. I think there about five
specific points that I labeled as areas
ABCD maybe E and these are
referenced on my crew notebook in my crew notebook for specific observations
But in general, I did not put that to as much use as I expected one item is that that chart should have been identical to the
CMP chart and there were a few pen and ink changes left off of it that caused some confusion at one point
pen and ink exposure
Settings for certain photo targets. The CSM
In the landmark maps that the LNP had added in the rear of that book
Again, we're not used I really thought I would use those but in the
You
became reluctant as you were observing a specific point our area targets a such as begaren or something like that to
To take time out to sketch on the photo. I tended for the two or three minutes at observation was possible of a given area
I tended to to look and then
At the first opportunity to take notes in the notebook rather than trying to sketch on the photograph
And I suspect that this was because I tended to look for generalizations about the
Target that I was trying to observe rather than
checking out specific
Individual features and they really did not seem to be any
need to
Make notes about specific points on the pictures and as a result, I did not use them
Again, though, I think having selected them and studied them pre-flight made it worth having them around
The necessity for flying them was probably less than the necessity for having reviewed them and study them
I think I still if I had to do it again
I still would want to have that kind of data available in the spacecraft even though it on this particular mission it was not used
I do think though that the CMP used his visual target maps
considerably and I did in a couple occasions that used some of the
ones that he had again
but for the most part that was post-tei
And I made some notes and sketches on some of those
maps
When the and I think that just a function that there was a lot of time to look at the moon and make a sketch and then look back and
And fix it up post-tei. We're in orbit the time just to not exist
As Dick Gordon said a couple years ago and once you start flying
Clock is relentless. Okay general flight planning
I was not very closely involved in the flight planning
Ron sort of carried the burden of that
for both gene and myself
uh
The flight plan was excellent
We had no problems with it at all that I'm aware of
Tommy Holloway and his people were to be complemented on that the
number of different requirements and experiments and
General operational items that were required to be integrated one with the other
Was very very high and it was done in an extremely
Competitive and and usable way and I don't
Can't think of anything that I would would change in the way the flight plan was written. Okay
23-5
Pre-flight support
Pre-flight support was excellent in the flight data file area and
uh
One specific item that I had
Was once the flight plan was well established
Just about at the final stage
I had
Two or three textile remember two or three
Briefing sessions were in the portions of the in orbit flight plan that I was going to be
During which I would be in
Was going to be in the spacecraft and the CSM
Uh, we went over in detail the attitudes and maneuvers and the
Available window availability so that that I was able to plan in a very short amount of time with minimal effort on my part
the my own personal
Observations of the lunar surface
And which went very well as far as planning was concerned
Appreciate it that that was extra above and beyond the color duty on the part of the flight planners and I
appreciated
Of their taking time out to do that for me
the uh, I think it was uh
useful to
have the uh, I think it was a day-long session
where the flight controllers and the crew
and the flight planners sat around
In one room and went over those portions of the flight plan which were not normally simulated
Uh, it turned out that the flight plan had been so
Well-done that the I doubt if there were any specific items that
Came up that we needed to do change or there was seem to be a lack of coordination on
This was in contrast to the previous flights where I think the flights where I think we were still learning
All of us were learning on how to put together flight plans and integrate requirements
Seven the policy 17 flight plan apparently reached the
peak of perfection
I was a little bit disappointed in that briefing and that some of the people who would be eventually
involved in the mission were not at the flight plan review
And I think this was because of
of
conflicts with other programs which were the center. I was carrying out at the time
Okay 24.0 visual sightings covered the countdown and
launch I think pretty well in the
previous sections
also card flight
Earth orbit. I think the transcript would cover the visual sightings that I made with respect to
weather and
a few geographic
observations and that same would go for the
fairly
extensive weather observations that I tried to make trans
our trans lunar
trans earth we had only a small crescent of an earth and it was not feasible to do an extensive
weather observations. I don't know whether I recorded yet that
although we had light flashes just about continuously during the whole
flight when you when it was when you were dark adapted
and I may have even had one which I thought was a flash on the lunar surface
during the first rev that one period of time when we had the blindfolds on for the
ultimate experiment there just were no visible flashes although the next that evening that night
before I went to sleep I noticed I was seeing the light flashes again
so it just seemed to be that one interval either side of that
that interval and either side of it where the light flash phenomena was not visible to
to myself or to the other two crewmen. Lunar orbit I think the transcript and
the my crew notebook would cover all the visual sightings that I can remember at this stage without
going over orbit by orbit and feature by feature with the photography I think that has to come
later. Entry recovered in the previous briefings and I think the same goes for lighting and
recovery once you stop at a second text. 25.0 pre-mission planning for the LNP
it's hard to think once again of anything that we didn't do right
I'm sure that might have been different had we had problems on the flight but right
the way the flight went the total plan the integration of the mission requirements into that plan
periods of some difficulty pre-flight particularly in the area of medical requirements
and in some last minute possible scientific requirements particularly on the samples
everything seemed to get resolved satisfactory in years I could tell and I don't I can't think of
anything that was not handled very well in particular between the people who were leveling the
requirements and the flight planners in particular and occasionally when the crew had to be involved
that was handled almost entirely by the support crew Bob Parker in the science area and
Cordy Fullerton and Bob Overfire in the operational areas. There were no significant spacecraft
changes in the course of our training period. Ron I guess the biggest single area that took time
was the one that Ron had to deal with and that was Lunar Sounder. Most of our out-step changes were
all taken care of prior to our training and we had a few minor suggestions that were taken care
of early in the training cycle and we essentially had an up-to-date out-step training with
and all other Lunar surface gear was up-to-date for most of the 12-month training period or the final 12
months of the training period. Mission rules and techniques were fairly well defined very early by
Phil Schaefer and his crowd and the techniques area and the mission rules are knee-jerry griffin
and people working on that. No major changes and only the only changes were all I felt in the
right direction and that they enhanced the probability of making a landing and a successful mission.
They opened, generally were in the area of opening up possibilities for workarounds so that a
mission could be completed. We really never had to exercise any significant, any of the mission
rules in a normal way. I think the one time that a mission rule tended to, let me finish this
check on everyone. A mission rule tended to be fairly clearly a controlling factor was in the
limitation on the work at Station 4 or Shorty Crater where we were up against the walk-back constraints
and terminated that work after only 35 minutes where another 30 minutes there I think would have
been extremely valuable although I hope that we got nothing information that the phenomena
exposed at that crater can be understood. They want you to stop it.
26.0 mission control typically outstanding support for mission control. I think the
this includes the number of extracurricular hours that the
limb people and the e-cums for the CSM in particular put in with me on Saturdays and other times
just generally talking over systems and techniques, mission rules and that was a major factor in
helping me understand and keep up to speed on those items. I think the help that they gave me
and designing and the fact is they essentially did it. They did the design of the emergency
cue cards that we did for Apollo 17 for the limb where it was a major contribution although
fortunately we did not use them. They still made it possible to understand very quickly
systems problems and to solve those problems in the simulations and had we require them
I think it would have gone very well. I particularly want to point out the help that Dick
Thorson gave in organizing most of the limb sessions and even some of the joint CSM limb sessions
that we had. He also, Thorson also was a major organizer of the creation of and the updating of
Bill's emergency cue cards. Human factors, 27.0. Let's go back. That's one other comment on 26.0.
Post-flight, it's my understanding that some of the things I had hoped could be done during
the flight were not possible because of real-time discussions in the mission control.
Specifically one of those things was to have some summary of the thinking of the science
background given to me while in flight and that would be the thinking based on the data that we
had transmitted to them verbally and essentially through the television camera. I had hoped that I
would have the benefit of their thinking but apparently this was not possible to do. I would like
to think that in the future we can look at ways of using the team approach to science investigations
in space rather than depending solely on the observational capability and the
interpretive capability of the men who are performing the job. There's no reason that I can see
it to not use all the brain power that's available for any given task and part of that brain
power is on the ground. A 27.0 human factors pre-flight. The brunt of the discussions and
organization from the crew point of view of the pre-flight health stabilization control program
was born by the commander and the LNP just sort of went along with whatever was decided.
Personally did not find any great difficulty in working out and adhering to the requirements
of that program. Medical care, all very limited requirement was good. A couple of sinus infections
I had reacted just like they always had and we were able over a period of 10 days or two weeks
to get those cleared up. Time for exercise probably was less than it should have been although
I was able to get a good workout just about every other day in addition to the workouts we got
as a normal course of our EVA training. Eventually techs started scheduling, putting on the schedule
time in the late afternoon for exercise and that helped as a reminder and buffer to see that
exercise was obtained. It is generally hard, at least in the lunar training program,
to get exercise periods in during the day and quite frequently the exercise was done in the
Cape Jim at night. I think rest and sleep is an individual thing and I made a particular effort
to always get as much as I possibly could and try never to get behind the parker on rest
because my personal experience is that that is when I tend to get coals and resulting sinus
infections. Medical briefing was good. The exams seemed to go very well in my estimation.
They were as expeditious as possible under the circumstances and I think the
operational medical personnel who carried out the exams are to be complemented in their
efforts to see that the exam was as painless and as efficient as possible.
And this should also include the post-flight exams on the Taekwondo River. Eating habits and
amount of food consumption were normal except during those periods of time when we were on the
inflight food prior to launch and those times there tended to be in my case a decrease of appetite
and certainly although the food was certainly palatable my appetite did go down
and certainly it was not possible for me to eat the amount of food that was provided for me.
This also applied to space work but in the case of the inflight eating although I did not
eat everything that was available to me and my food packages I apparently should
needed to if I hadn't wanted to avoid losing weight. My appetite was down but also apparently
for some reason I had a loss of weight and at this time of this recording my weight is still down
and has not gone up to a pre-flight levels which may have been a little high by the way.
Okay 17.2 flight appetite and food preference well I just discussed that a little bit
and the appetite in flight versus to each pre-flight was less again except for when we were testing
the pre-flight food when I also had a low appetite notable differences in the taste of food
I think the things I like pre-flight I liked in space and the things I didn't like I also
didn't like I didn't notice any differences change in food preferences of flight progressed
I tended to start to prefer to eat the wet packs and would
eat those in preference to any of the other solid foods. I would strongly recommend
from my personal point of view at any rate that the wet packs be used in preference to the
rehydratable. I know I think that probably you get a different opinion from the other crew.
The juices were good after first period of one and only a period of difficulty with loose
bowel movements I did cut out the potassium indicated foods and although I can't say whether
that had any effect or not but I would did not have any other loose I did not have any other
bowel movements and certainly no more loose ones before the end of the flight. The first
bowel movement after flight on the time of the tyton of roger was normal the second was very
loose the third was normal and the fourth and fifth very loose the size of food portions and the
meal portions of course were pretty much constant in terms of availability packaging but the my
appetite was very low the first day and gradually increased over the next two or three days
and remained essentially the same after about the third day. I mentioned the most acceptable foods
were the wet packs and the juices the food cake I thought was good although it was possible to
eat too much or to get to a point where you didn't want anymore the chocolate was good I think of
the dry crackers or cookies or graham crackers were probably the most tasty and peanut butter
and jelly sandwiches were quite good deviations from the menu and the periods are all recorded in the
flight transcripts I'm sure okay food preparation and consumption. Rehydration
went I think normally and the nominal gas was present. Food temperature tended to
prefer the foods that were warm or hot and the hot water was quite adequate for warm foods we
actually I think missed the warm foods considerably in the limb where that hot water was not available.
I did not notice an effect of water flavor water was was reasonably tasty I mean it did not
I never noticed a high chlorine taste of any kind. Oh the gas content did make it a little bit
uncomfortable to eat at times. Spoon bowl packages worked pretty well although those that were
finally divided I tended to cut off the other end of the package the water insertion in
and use them as a squeeze package. Spoon's worked perfectly adequate. I attended not to use the fruit
in the cans because of just the messiness of opening those although they're I think the technique
that Ron worked out was opening it in your inner inner your mouth is a good one. Putteams and
this kind of thing were very good it was only the fruits the canned fruits that I tended to avoid
just because they were inconvenient to use. Food bars during EVAs I think were good to have although
I never ate more than half of one. It wasn't because it was untasty it just because of a
maybe a lack of interest in eating and using that time during the EVAs. We I think after the EVA
before and after EVAs in the limb ate very well. There were some things though we did not we
avoided and I guess in my case after one having corn chowder once and that simulating a major
valve movement although not a useless one. I tended not I did not eat corn chowder I did not eat
the cocoa because I tended to feel like I got a little more per gas from cocoa and after taste I
did not eat the shrimp the seafood the item shrimp and the lobster biscuit these sort of things
because of a pre-flight I had noticed that they tended to have a long after taste but otherwise
I think all the other foods were certainly acceptable. Yeah although many times I did not eat potato
based food waste storage I don't know how the German side old tablet worked the pouch was okay
we're a nice to have a little dispenser that was easier to use in the pouch I don't know
whether that would be possible to do or not it seems to me it would a little tube dispenser
of some kind where they came out more easily. You didn't tend to we generally just cut the
corner off a pouch and squeezed them out but it did it was a little inconvenient nothing major
we used the German side of tablets I did a raid in all the juice bags and the food spoonful bags
and the wet packs I did not use them in the tea and coffee. Under desirable holders really except
for the passing of gas occasionally by the other crewmen and some occasionally by myself
I did not find that the atmosphere was unpleasant as a general rule I might say that I generally had
a continuous almost continuous passage of gas most of which apparently was not with significant
odor only occasionally that seemed to be objectionable to the other crewmen and I think most
of that was the water gas and the reason I think that is that upon eating upon starting to eat
there would be an increased desire to pass gas increased pressure my stomach apparently was
transmitted almost immediately into the bile and I would after eating it would pass gas for a couple
hours to three hours and just before eating the next time the desire would have had pretty well
dissipated and then it would start again immediately immediately upon eating before any digestion
was possible I'm sure so I suspect the water gas was the main culprit in the LNP's gas problem
which were not significant quantity of food eaten on the lunar surface I think was high although
probably no more than half of that food that was available it's hard to say exactly and I think
that could be worked out maybe with a detailed look at the menus if that is desirable and to
estimate the quantity would be very difficult food quantity of food discarded on the lunar surface
and be difficult without looking at the detailed menus and checking off those items that I'm sure
we ate that I ate it anyway it's quite a lot of people contain I don't know what we have that
we use the blue bag the blue bag is not a bad way to to defecate unless the stool is loose
if it's loose it's just about impossible to use and I don't know what you do is your
Gary for lose stool I don't know of any clever ways prevent that being a problem and I'm not
even sure whatever this guy will have people are using will prevent that from being a problem the
best thing you can do is to work out prevention of lose stools rather than trying to handle them
after you get them it is a loose stool is one of the major hygiene and sanitary and operational
problems that you can have on a flight I can't emphasize that more you can if it happened on a
regular basis on a daily basis you would I think eventually cut the efficiency of the crew member
with the problem bias significant percentage possibly as much as a 30% depending on the magnitude of
the problem I think it's important to try to understand why poly 17 was different than 16 and at
least in the delay of a problem of lose stools until about the 11th or 12th day and in the case
the commander no problem of lose stools and my personal opinion at this point based on
the information other than observation and flight and thinking about levels of flight intake is
that with the electrolyte quantity down from that posed on the Apollo 16 that we did not reach
a electrolyte saturation level until the 11th or 12th day in terms of this CMP and the
and in terms of the commander because his electrolyte intake was generally less I think and that
can be documented he didn't he did not reach a saturation level at all and when that saturation
level was reached however in the case of the CMP and LMB I suspect that dumped in a sensor concentrated
in the intestines and tended to act pretty much as a laxity an absence all type laxity if you
and concentrate on the first guy lab that first of all reduce the electrolyte intake so that
saturation is never reached and secondly that if a lose stool problem develops it appears to be
an electrolyte problem. Decrease the intake of electrolytes this is what I did on my own and whether
or not it worked or not it's hard to say because the flight was terminated before any other
stools occurred okay water orientation odor was not apparent to me except during chlorination
identification odor is very slight apparent in the limb water but not not have any significance
to the LMB physical discomfort no physical discomfort for the LMB other than tiredness on
occasion and in the case of the of the EVA work sore muscles and the bruises under the fingernails
gas water separator didn't work very effectively and I'm sure that's been discussed with elsewhere
intensity of thirst during the mission never really thirsty extensively thirsty even during
the EVA so although I did stop to take a drink of water occasionally but I never drunk I never
drank all the water in the inflight drink bag in suit drink bag rest and sleep okay hey text could
you try to call the call of trade or was I work rest sleep for the LMB okay the difficulty
going to sleep was variable and when seekinol was used generally no difficulty in going to sleep
when it was not used I guess there was a tendency to stay awake a little bit longer but on other
occasions the absence seekinol did not seem to affect the rate of going to sleep there was a tendency
on a couple on several nights to go to sleep and then wake up fairly soon after going to sleep
within an hour and then the second time took a little bit maybe sometimes took up to an hour to go
back to sleep but I feel that the medical law reports that for the LMB were generally valid that
a probably average of five and a half to six hours of sleep per night was good and I don't think
except for maybe one night somewhere in there did I go much below that but the sleep was
rarely can probably never continuous for more than three hours without waking up I feel that
six hours is adequate sleep for the kind of work we were doing in space however the programming of
eight hours is necessary in order to get six hours because of the periods of wakefulness when
during sleep periods and for just the difficulty in getting the cabin organized and
everybody to bed at the pride program time so maintaining an eight hour sleep period is I think
mandatory in order to obtain the six hours that is probably all it is required to perform the mission
without getting tired or getting behind the power curve as I say with respect to sleep restraints
I had the feeling that to find them by the way I had the feeling that I wanted to have my
head and limbs restrained in order to get a good sleep although I did sleep at times without without
that restraint I if I were rebuilding the sleep restraints for my personal use I would make them
smaller with somewhat more feeling of restraint they're a little bit large I would say for use
when I slept in the couch I tended to put a shoulder strap over my head and sent you down very
lightly so that I had that feeling of head restraint probably the biggest two things that made
sleep difficult when it was difficult was the loss of sensory perception of limb position
in zero gravity when when they were not being moved that perception came back immediately upon moving
them but when they were just static and in a rest position they tended to be for for the LNP
anyway the loss of sensory perception of the position of the limb